Ishavasya Upanishad Webinar
Reflection Questions Day 5
Poll:
  1. How does the Self move and not move?
  2. How is the Self both far and near?
  3. How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7?

1. How does the Self move and not move? 2. How is the Self both far and near? 3. How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7?

1.Perceptions are always relative.With reference to the waves,the Ocean is motionless.So too in life the Atman in its all pervading nature is motionless.It neither acts nor works.But with reference to the matter enveloping around it,life can be defined as thinking,feeling or acting.For instance the boat moves but never the lake.
With reference to a moving factor,the motionless would look as though moving,though itself is motionless or still.When viewed from a moving boat,the trees on the bank are seen as moving.So also viewing the motionless Spirit of life from and through the world of agitations in matter,the Spirit itself looks as though It moves, and yet, in its real nature,it does not.
To a person suffering from vertigo,the room alongwith all the objects in it and all people around seem to be spinning when in actuality it is not...that is merely an illusion of his perception owing to his ailment.!!!
The pure awareness or consciousness, in all its pervading, essential nature,neither moves nor acts.
This is how the self appears to move and not move at the same time.


1.Perceptions are always relative.With reference to the waves,the Ocean is motionless.So too in life the Atman in its all pervading nature is motionless.It neither acts nor works.But with reference to the matter enveloping around it,life can be defined as thinking,feeling or acting.For instance the boat moves but never the lake. With reference to a moving factor,the motionless would look as though moving,though itself is motionless or still.When viewed from a moving boat,the trees on the bank are seen as moving.So also viewing the motionless Spirit of life from and through the world of agitations in matter,the Spirit itself looks as though It moves, and yet, in its real nature,it does not. To a person suffering from vertigo,the room alongwith all the objects in it and all people around seem to be spinning when in actuality it is not...that is merely an illusion of his perception owing to his ailment.!!! The pure awareness or consciousness, in all its pervading, essential nature,neither moves nor acts. This is how the self appears to move and not move at the same time.
  1. Self with Upadhi (Sopadhika aspect) always moves/changesEg: when hand moves & even when the hand is stationary ( because not acting itself is an action)Self in Nirupadhika aspect doesn't move /change eg: Even when hand moves/doesn't move there is no change in Self.

  2. Self is farFor those who are ignorant about it, it is so far like 100s of crores of years because they keep on taking births without realising Self.Self is nearFor those who have realised their own nature as Self, it is very near (closest possible because there is no difference).

  3. When one sees Self in all & all in Self( means only Self is present),his delusion of individuality goes away.So he doesn't desire to accumulate for his particular body mind.When others have something better, he doesn't feel angry or jealous.Thus he gets rid of sorrows.


1. Self with Upadhi (Sopadhika aspect) always moves/changes Eg: when hand moves & even when the hand is stationary ( because not acting itself is an action) Self in Nirupadhika aspect doesn't move /change eg: Even when hand moves/doesn't move there is no change in Self. 2. Self is far For those who are ignorant about it, it is so far like 100s of crores of years because they keep on taking births without realising Self. Self is near For those who have realised their own nature as Self, it is very near (closest possible because there is no difference). 3. When one sees Self in all & all in Self( means only Self is present), his delusion of individuality goes away. So he doesn't desire to accumulate for his particular body mind. When others have something better, he doesn't feel angry or jealous. Thus he gets rid of sorrows.

How does the Self move and not move?
SELF is like space. It is inside and outside both. Wherever you go the space is there. The same way, SELF being all pervading is everywhere. It is inside and outside as well.
It moves when it is a reflected consciousness but when the pure consciousness is seen it does not move.


How does the Self move and not move? SELF is like space. It is inside and outside both. Wherever you go the space is there. The same way, SELF being all pervading is everywhere. It is inside and outside as well. It moves when it is a reflected consciousness but when the pure consciousness is seen it does not move.

How is the Self both far and near?


It is about the realization of Self. For an Ignorant person who is not aware of the concept of Self and is completely engrossed with Dehabhimaan and Upadhis, He may not even realize even after hundreds of crores of years.
But for a Gyani or wise, he knows that he doesn't need to find the self anywhere, but it is himself. There can't be anything closer than this.


How is the Self both far and near? It is about the realization of Self. For an Ignorant person who is not aware of the concept of Self and is completely engrossed with Dehabhimaan and Upadhis, He may not even realize even after hundreds of crores of years. But for a Gyani or wise, he knows that he doesn't need to find the self anywhere, but it is himself. There can't be anything closer than this.

How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7?
In the verse, "ekatvananupashyat" is the explanation for the end of delusion and sorrow.
Once you realize that all the objects are nothing but the reflection of you only, there won't be any such feeling.
It happens only because of the Dehabhiman. Whatever is suitable to you brings delusion and whatever is not favorable or favorable to others bring sorrow.
For the wise there is no soka and no moha.
In Geeta also it is said that "Yoga Samatvam Uchyate" Which means to maintain the feeling of equanimity by the realization.


How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7? In the verse, "ekatvananupashyat" is the explanation for the end of delusion and sorrow. Once you realize that all the objects are nothing but the reflection of you only, there won't be any such feeling. It happens only because of the Dehabhiman. Whatever is suitable to you brings delusion and whatever is not favorable or favorable to others bring sorrow. For the wise there is no soka and no moha. In Geeta also it is said that "Yoga Samatvam Uchyate" Which means to maintain the feeling of equanimity by the realization.

Reflection 5. Answer 1.
The SELF WITHOUT upaadhis does NOT move, does NOT change and is ALL-PERVADING.
The SELF WITH upaadhis appears to be MOVING, and is said to be RUNNING faster than the MIND and SENSES( indriyas)!! This appears SO, because the SELF is all-pervading, and therefore seen in an object, well before the mind reaches the object of its desire!!


The ALL PERVASIVENESS of the SELF is responsible for the appearance of MOVEMENT in the SELF. The SELF enables the mind to move but is MOTIONLESS.


Answer 2. The SELF is FAR for a person of IGNORANCE, who does not seek SELF-REALISATION
for hundred crores of years and remains in blinding darkness.


The SELF is NEAR, for a seeker who has realised the SELF. The SELF is NOT SOMEONE ELSE!! The SELF is HIMSELF!!


Answer 3. In verse 7, of the ishavasya upanishad, He who sees the SELF as the SUBSTRATUM, the ADHISTHAANA on which are SUPER-IMPOSED the body, mind and intellect( upadhis),
He who sees the SELF in ALL SENTIENT BEINGS and NON-SENTIENT OBJECTS,
He who sees the SELF in himself as the same SELF in all sentient and non-sentient objects,
He who realise that the JAGAT is a superimposition on the SELF( substratum), i.e. BRAHMA SATYAM, JAGAN-MITYA,
He who sees that there is ONLY the ONE SELF and nothing else in the cosmos, therefore there is NO CAUSE for raaga and Dwesha, BECOMES FREE of DELUSION and SORROW!! It is like realising that the waves and the ocean are but WATER!!
Hari Aum,
Prema V. Iyer.


Reflection 5. Answer 1. The SELF WITHOUT upaadhis does NOT move, does NOT change and is ALL-PERVADING. The SELF WITH upaadhis appears to be MOVING, and is said to be RUNNING faster than the MIND and SENSES( indriyas)!! This appears SO, because the SELF is all-pervading, and therefore seen in an object, well before the mind reaches the object of its desire!! The ALL PERVASIVENESS of the SELF is responsible for the appearance of MOVEMENT in the SELF. The SELF enables the mind to move but is MOTIONLESS. Answer 2. The SELF is FAR for a person of IGNORANCE, who does not seek SELF-REALISATION for hundred crores of years and remains in blinding darkness. The SELF is NEAR, for a seeker who has realised the SELF. The SELF is NOT SOMEONE ELSE!! The SELF is HIMSELF!! Answer 3. In verse 7, of the ishavasya upanishad, He who sees the SELF as the SUBSTRATUM, the ADHISTHAANA on which are SUPER-IMPOSED the body, mind and intellect( upadhis), He who sees the SELF in ALL SENTIENT BEINGS and NON-SENTIENT OBJECTS, He who sees the SELF in himself as the same SELF in all sentient and non-sentient objects, He who realise that the JAGAT is a superimposition on the SELF( substratum), i.e. BRAHMA SATYAM, JAGAN-MITYA, He who sees that there is ONLY the ONE SELF and nothing else in the cosmos, therefore there is NO CAUSE for raaga and Dwesha, BECOMES FREE of DELUSION and SORROW!! It is like realising that the waves and the ocean are but WATER!! Hari Aum, Prema V. Iyer.

Self is realizing yourself as each and every minute particle in the Brahman. When your inner conscious is at the purest far then it is stationery, otherwise the reflections change


Upanishad is the scriptures that guide you to realize or even take a tiny step forward to attain higher, when ignorance prevails it us far off.


Dehabhiman is the mirroring of youself around the things you see. When it calms, sense of purpose is understood then happiness is there. Otherwise sorrow envelopes but realizing aham frees you from all that bringing neutrality in surrounding


Self is realizing yourself as each and every minute particle in the Brahman. When your inner conscious is at the purest far then it is stationery, otherwise the reflections change Upanishad is the scriptures that guide you to realize or even take a tiny step forward to attain higher, when ignorance prevails it us far off. Dehabhiman is the mirroring of youself around the things you see. When it calms, sense of purpose is understood then happiness is there. Otherwise sorrow envelopes but realizing aham frees you from all that bringing neutrality in surrounding

How does the SELF move and not Move?


When the Sopadika drishti is used every object and being in the Jagat is the SELF. So when any of these objects move then it can be considered that the SELF is moving.
When Nirupadika drishti is used then the SELF is ALL PERVADING i.e present everywhere in every space, object and being. Therefore there is no question of the SELF moving here as even if theoritically we suppose SELF could move then where would it move to?


How does the SELF move and not Move? When the Sopadika drishti is used every object and being in the Jagat is the SELF. So when any of these objects move then it can be considered that the SELF is moving. When Nirupadika drishti is used then the SELF is ALL PERVADING i.e present everywhere in every space, object and being. Therefore there is no question of the SELF moving here as even if theoritically we suppose SELF could move then where would it move to?

How is the SELF both far and Near?


As the SELF is ALL pervading therefore it can be looked at as being both near and faraway.
A second way to understand this is - it is MOST FAR away for the ignorant Jeeva or Seeker and for the realised Gnani it is the most nearest as the Gnani is the SELF.


How is the SELF both far and Near? As the SELF is ALL pervading therefore it can be looked at as being both near and faraway. A second way to understand this is - it is MOST FAR away for the ignorant Jeeva or Seeker and for the realised Gnani it is the most nearest as the Gnani is the SELF.

When we talk about Brahman with upadhi it is moving because it is the cause for the mind & sense organs to move. It is because of this conciousness that the mind & senses move. The nirupadhika Brahman is pervading the whole space. So it does not have any movement.


When we talk about Brahman with upadhi it is moving because it is the cause for the mind & sense organs to move. It is because of this conciousness that the mind & senses move. The nirupadhika Brahman is pervading the whole space. So it does not have any movement.

The Self is in the core of all beings. So it is the nearest. It is also the farthest because it is all pervasive. Sarva vyapi. It is inside & also outside


The Self is in the core of all beings. So it is the nearest. It is also the farthest because it is all pervasive. Sarva vyapi. It is inside & also outside

Verse 7 - Ending of Delusion and sorrow:


The core Delusion of the Agnani is because he identifies with his Upadhis. He thinks he (the SELF) is the body, Mind or the Intellet etc. This delusion is the first step. The moment he identifies with his upadhis when the he comes upon anything that is suitable to his upadhis then the Upadhi reacts joyously and feels happy. Likewise anything he comes across which is unsuitable to his upadhis they react unfavourably and sorrow results. Thus Moha the first step leads to Shoka in step 2. Now to the Knower when all beings become one in his own SELF (Atman) whereis the question of being deluded any more? Any without delusion where is the question of going to step 2 Shoka? For one who sees Oneness everywhere what grief can there be. Thus Realisation i.e seeing Oneness between the SELF and all beings is how Moha and shoka come to an end.


Verse 7 - Ending of Delusion and sorrow: The core Delusion of the Agnani is because he identifies with his Upadhis. He thinks he (the SELF) is the body, Mind or the Intellet etc. This delusion is the first step. The moment he identifies with his upadhis when the he comes upon anything that is suitable to his upadhis then the Upadhi reacts joyously and feels happy. Likewise anything he comes across which is unsuitable to his upadhis they react unfavourably and sorrow results. Thus Moha the first step leads to Shoka in step 2. Now to the Knower when all beings become one in his own SELF (Atman) whereis the question of being deluded any more? Any without delusion where is the question of going to step 2 Shoka? For one who sees Oneness everywhere what grief can there be. Thus Realisation i.e seeing Oneness between the SELF and all beings is how Moha and shoka come to an end.

A wise person when he sees the same conciousness in all the beings. There is no delusion or fear. He sees himself as the Self in all beings.


A wise person when he sees the same conciousness in all the beings. There is no delusion or fear. He sees himself as the Self in all beings.

1.How does the Self move and not move?
In its real absolute state it is immutable, but in its conditioned aspect it appears ever changing.


2.How is the Self both far and near?
It is Omnipresent.For the ignorant it is very far, difficult to obtain, but for the wise, it is very near , because they know that it is their very Self.


3.How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7?
There is no delusion, no sorrow for the person who pereives everything as his own Self.


1.How does the Self move and not move? In its real absolute state it is immutable, but in its conditioned aspect it appears ever changing. 2.How is the Self both far and near? It is Omnipresent.For the ignorant it is very far, difficult to obtain, but for the wise, it is very near , because they know that it is their very Self. 3.How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7? There is no delusion, no sorrow for the person who pereives everything as his own Self.

How does the Self move and not move?


ANSWER:


  • The Self moves meaning, w.r.t the upadhis (sopadika drushti) = tad ejati
  • The Self does not move, meaning, it is w.r.t the True nature of the Self (nirupadika drushti) = tan na ejati

Meaning non-moving it moves.

How is the Self both far and near?

ANSWER:

  • A hundred of crores of years also ignorant person has not attained (no knowledge about) the true nature of the Self and so referred as far = tad dure.
  • It is the most proximat because Atma is every moment experienced. It does not ever require senses or mind for a jnani = tat u antike

How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7?

ANSWER:

  • The delusion is because of the ignorance of our true nature. If through the jnana chakshu, if the true nature is realised, then the ignorance ends which in turns causes the delusion to end. - The sorrow is because of the identification with the upadis. Once we have ekam eva, then no more sorrow, as there is only one that is experienced everywhere.
  • Based on the upadis joy and sorrow are experienced. That is because of shat ripu (kama adi). Here after realisation, every one and everything is you and you only and so no more sorrow prevails.
  • There is nothing other than one's Self after realisation of True Nature/Identity.
  • So for the seer of Oneself, there is no more delusion or sorrow.

**How does the Self move and not move?** ------------------------------------ **ANSWER:** - The Self moves meaning, w.r.t the upadhis (sopadika drushti) = tad ejati - The Self does not move, meaning, it is w.r.t the True nature of the Self (nirupadika drushti) = tan na ejati Meaning non-moving it moves. How is the Self both far and near? ---------------------------------- **ANSWER:** - A hundred of crores of years also ignorant person has not attained (no knowledge about) the true nature of the Self and so referred as far = tad dure. - It is the most proximat because Atma is every moment experienced. It does not ever require senses or mind for a jnani = tat u antike How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7? ------------------------------------------------------------------ **ANSWER:** - The delusion is because of the ignorance of our true nature. If through the jnana chakshu, if the true nature is realised, then the ignorance ends which in turns causes the delusion to end. - The sorrow is because of the identification with the upadis. Once we have ekam eva, then no more sorrow, as there is only one that is experienced everywhere. - Based on the upadis joy and sorrow are experienced. That is because of shat ripu (kama adi). Here after realisation, every one and everything is you and you only and so no more sorrow prevails. - There is nothing other than one's Self after realisation of True Nature/Identity. - So for the seer of Oneself, there is no more delusion or sorrow.

Hari Om,


  1. From the Sopādhika Drishti the Self moves - the Self associated with the upādhis that is as the Reflected Consciousness it moves with the upādhis as the empowering agent. From the Nirupādhika Drishti, the Self - Pure Consciousness does not move for it is ever there, ever still, the changeless substratum.

  2. For the ignorant one’s going through lifetime after lifetime for crores of lifetimes having no idea of the Self nor the inclination to find out about the Self for such ones the Self is very far. For the wise, the Jñāni it is nearest of the near for having known the Self they experience it as their very own Self.

  3. As per the Upaniṣad in verse 7 when the knowledge of the Self is attained and realized the delusion of individuality ends. When delusion ends attachments and sorrows end. For the wise one’s experiential reality is that all beings and objects is the One Truth, the Self that he/she is.


Hari Om, 1. From the Sopādhika Drishti the Self moves - the Self associated with the upādhis that is as the Reflected Consciousness it moves with the upādhis as the empowering agent. From the Nirupādhika Drishti, the Self - Pure Consciousness does not move for it is ever there, ever still, the changeless substratum. 2. For the ignorant one’s going through lifetime after lifetime for crores of lifetimes having no idea of the Self nor the inclination to find out about the Self for such ones the Self is very far. For the wise, the Jñāni it is nearest of the near for having known the Self they experience it as their very own Self. 3. As per the Upaniṣad in verse 7 when the knowledge of the Self is attained and realized the delusion of individuality ends. When delusion ends attachments and sorrows end. For the wise one’s experiential reality is that all beings and objects is the One Truth, the Self that he/she is.

1.How does the Self move and not move?


From the standpoint of sopadhik drsti the Self appears to be moving; it is the presence of Consciousness that enables everything to function whereas from the standpoint of nirupadhik drsti the Self does not move. The true nature of the Self is beyond upadhis - enabling the action it is actionless, doing everything it does nothing.


2.How is the Self both far and near?


The Self is far for the agyani - the one who is ignorant, who has no inclination for the knowledge of the Self. Whereas the Self is very near for the gyani - the wise, the one who has gained the atmagyana that he is this Self alone.


3.How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7?


As per the upaniṣad in verse 7 when you attain the sarvatmabhava - the knowledge that all beings are but you and you alone and you see that Reality alone everywhwere and in everyone then your (moha-the delusion) dehabhimana - the notion of individuality and soka - sorrow they both end.


1.How does the Self move and not move? From the standpoint of sopadhik drsti the Self appears to be moving; it is the presence of Consciousness that enables everything to function whereas from the standpoint of nirupadhik drsti the Self does not move. The true nature of the Self is beyond upadhis - enabling the action it is actionless, doing everything it does nothing. 2.How is the Self both far and near? The Self is far for the agyani -  the one who is ignorant, who has no inclination for the knowledge of the Self. Whereas the Self is very near for the gyani - the wise, the one who has gained the atmagyana that he is this Self alone. 3.How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7? As per the upaniṣad in verse 7 when you attain the sarvatmabhava - the knowledge that all beings are but you and you alone and you see that Reality alone everywhwere and in everyone then your (moha-the delusion) dehabhimana - the notion of individuality and soka - sorrow they  both end.
Day 5 Reflection:

  1. How does the Self move and not move?
    ans:
    Mind moves it sees the illumining Self is present already in the new place so it assumes the self is moving faster than it and hence assumes the Self moves. From Self’s all-pervading nature there is no need for its movement and hence in that sense IT does not move.
  2. How is the Self both far and near?
    ans:
    Far because the ignorant is not able to realize it even after many jenmas with the thinking he is this body. For a jnani Self is himself and hence it is near.
  3. How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7?
    ans:
    With the knowledge that all beings and objects are him alone his delusion and sorry ended.

##### Day 5 Reflection: 1. How does the Self move and not move? ###### ans: Mind moves it sees the illumining Self is present already in the new place so it assumes the self is moving faster than it and hence assumes the Self moves. From Self’s all-pervading nature there is no need for its movement and hence in that sense IT does not move. 2. How is the Self both far and near? ###### ans: Far because the ignorant is not able to realize it even after many jenmas with the thinking he is this body. For a jnani Self is himself and hence it is near. 3. How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7? ###### ans: With the knowledge that all beings and objects are him alone his delusion and sorry ended.

How does the Self move and not move?
Self does not move as it is the changeless presence enabling all change.
No object can appear without the existence of the Self.
Self is silent, most subtle and still always.
Self moves with respect to the sopadika drishti/upadhis. Whether the hands move or not, it refers to the Self moving. Self does nothing, yet, Self is doing everything by its very presence - Sannidhi Matrena.


How is the Self both far and near? When the wise see it as one's own Self, it is near and when one sees not even in a million years because of ignorance, it is very far.


How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7?
When one sees all beings as one's own Self, there is sarvatma bhava. There is no delusion or sorrow when there is experience of the one Self in and through the upadhis.


How does the Self move and not move? Self does not move as it is the changeless presence enabling all change. No object can appear without the existence of the Self. Self is silent, most subtle and still always. Self moves with respect to the sopadika drishti/upadhis. Whether the hands move or not, it refers to the Self moving. Self does nothing, yet, Self is doing everything by its very presence - Sannidhi Matrena. How is the Self both far and near? When the wise see it as one's own Self, it is near and when one sees not even in a million years because of ignorance, it is very far. How is delusion and sorrow ended, as per the upaniṣad in verse 7? When one sees all beings as one's own Self, there is sarvatma bhava. There is no delusion or sorrow when there is experience of the one Self in and through the upadhis.
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